True Crime Analysis, Breakthroughs, Insights & Discussions Hosted by Bestselling Author Nick van der Leek

More of Shan’ann’s Thrive Videos You May Missed

November 23, 2016 at 8:43 AM 

At 03:47:

“I’m working on getting my flight included…”


“Both of us get our cars paid for…”

November 22, 2016 at 8:40 AM

At 05:22:

“Ceecee’s been a crying mess for two weeks…”

October 30, 2017 at 10:51 AM


“The kids are off at school, and you’d think I’d have a break, a breather…but Deeter is a pain…”

January 18, 2017 at 11:16 AM


“I have a crush on Cory…because he’s super cute. Cory when you watch this later, I love you.”

April 12, 2017 at 4:27 PM

April 21, 2018 at 12:36 PM

January 20, 2017 at 2:43 PM


“Today is business day…”

May 4 , 2018 at 12:57 PM


[Referring to Nickole Atkinson]:

“Yeah, she’s worked all night last night, and now she’s still up, hasn’t slept yet because…”



  1. Pam Foldesi

    Have you created a list of all the people interviewed, and those who contributed to the investigation?

    • Nick

      No, but it’s not a bad idea.

  2. Marie

    CeeCee is a crying mess for 2 weeks , Deeper is a pain. But Cory is cute and she loves him. Imagine having her for an ex,, the rest of your life..

    • Marie

      oooops, Deeter

    • mitzi2006

      Apparently she’s a pretty good ex to have, is still very good friends with her ex mother in law, ex husband didn’t have really anything bad to say except when they started having problems she’d sometimes avoid home….think they gave better reviews of her than a lot of people would get from their ex husband and ex mother in law….apparently Cindy was the problem

  3. Sylvester

    I wonder who planted the idea in Bella’s head that CeCe was going to be dead if she ate coconut? Given that she was so concerned about it so close to her time of death could she have overheard an argument between her parents on the 8th, 9th, 10th of August? Or was Sha’nann just unable to let it go from the time the peanut incident happened right on up to leaving for Arizona. That’s one theory – another is that Chris may have intentionally tried to frighten her continuing his behavior of acting irritable and short-tempered around the girls from the NC trip. I learned a new word last night – “prolepsis.” It’s defined as the representation of a future act or development as if presently existing or accomplished. Certainly the staging of the doll would have been “proleptic.”

    • Marie

      Sylvester, is that why Bella was being so protective of CeeCee in the video? It was so strange. Take CeeCee away? How does that fit in with an allergy?

      • Sylvester

        Hi Marie – I think the video above is a different time when CeCe was sick. Bella told the babysitter, McKenna, on the night she babysat while Chris was on his date with NK that she was worried and afraid her sister would die if she ate coconut. It’s just kind of odd given she would be so worried about it on the 12th.

    • Maura

      Bella may have heard her mom tell CeCe that she couldn’t eat something when they were out because it had nuts in it. Maybe she thought coconut was part of her sister’s allergy because it ends in “nut”.

      Sad story out of NY where an 11 year old buy died from a rare allergic reaction to smelling cooking fish. The boy had asthma and was allergic to fish and peanuts too.

  4. tbp

    I find it interesting how she describes coming home from a work trip late at night. She said she came home tired, but she mentions how she unpacked her bags at 10 or 11 pm after her trip. If this her MO, you would think she her suitcase would have been unpacked before bed. At the very least, it would have been in her room. This was from her spiel in the last video posted on her.

    • nickvdl

      Yes, it’s been my position from the get go that she would never have dumped her suitcase downstairs, and she would have bathed or showered and removed her make-up if she had the opportunity to prepare for bed.

      Her family will probably know best whether she slept in a bra, but given her lupus and sensitive skin, I personally doubt she would. Not sure whether pregnancy has an impact on sleeping with or without a bra, but regardless, based on her habits she likely never went to bed, and I believe she never even made it upstairs.

      • Cheryl Filar

        Bras are hideous and confining, especially when you’re pregnant. You’re right: she never made it to bed.

        • nickvdl

          Agree, bras are hideous.

      • mitzi2006

        Not uncommon, my daughter is well endowed and wearing a bra to bed during her pregnancy when they hurt helped a lot as they weren’t as painful when she’d change positions. Mentioned it to my mom at that time and she said she had worn hers to bed too because it helped. I am not judging the suitcase at the bottom as in her normal times, it was late, she’d had a harrowing few weeks of poor sleep, was pregnant and emotional, delayed getting home, was nervous her flight wasn’t going to happen that night, not feeling well and was not eating well. You do things at a time like that which might be out of your norm, like removing makeup, showering and just collapse into bed

        • nickvdl

          It’s not whether it’s uncommon, it’s whether it’s Shan’ann’s MO. Know what I mean?

      • sheis

        I think the bra thing is a very individual preference. When I was pregnant, I preferred to wear one all the time, even for sleep. Any extra movement was painful.

        Ordinarily, that bra comes off as soon as I’m home for the night.

        I have a well-endowed friend who only takes hers off to bathe.

        Everyone’s different.

      • julinka1981

        She also could have chosen not to carry heavy suitcase since she is pregnant.But regardless of suitcase,she would have taken make up off and brushed her teeth,changed to PJ’s. We established (actually Nick did 🙂 she never made it upstairs.

      • LaraLeon

        The first thing I do when I get home every day is to take my bra off so I can feel free again. It is very uncomfortable. Being pregnant and tired from a trip and with lupus aches, it would make even more uncomfortable. She never had a chance to take it off.

  5. Sylvester

    I don’t understand why Chris would want to redress Sha’nann when he hoped by burying her she would never be found. That just seems odd to me. I mean, why bother?

    • Marie

      Maybe it was more undressing her Sylvester. She could have had the tee shirt on , under the hoodie. Seems to me that she was buried hurriedly and temporarily.

      • Sylvester

        He sure seemed anxious to go back to work, didn’t he

  6. Marie

    Sylvester, thanks for explaining that for me. I was thinking maybe the girls had heard their parents arguments about custody. It is strange for Bella to have been worried about that on the 12th.

    • Sylvester

      Yeah, it does Marie. I just keep thinking that that last weekend Chris had alone with the girls he must have looked at them like they were interfering with his life. Even the look on his face at the birthday party – he looks mean.

      • Marie

        The videos and photos of him before the murders look so different. It is so odd, like a nastiness had come to a head in him

      • julinka1981

        I must have missed those pics.Are they ok this site?

      • Janet

        Those girls were for the most part Ill-behaved. Parents didn’t teach them proper manners, and would do things like bounce them up and down and encourage them to “go” when they were already wound up from prednisone and kiddie Thrive. Both girls had speech problems for their age because parents spent no quality time with them correcting mispronounced words and helping them learn new words. Plus, they used a lot of baby talk. These are some of the reasons why certain kids get held back in school. Chris bore the brunt of these child-rearing mistakes because Shannon was too busy with videos, phone messaging and Thrive. Discovery says during the family’s last weekend in NC, Cece was acting particularly loud and wild and Chris walked away from her.

  7. Sylvester

    Oh wait a minute – to remove his DNA from her clothing? In particular the hoodie and t shirt. That’s what he popped into the dirty clothes basket I think.

    • Maura

      Yes, or clothing fibers or anything that could be connected to him. Imagine if he’d been caught with the bodies in his car. He probably disposed of the blue blanket which the kids may have been using that night he killed them. If he didn’t wash it he disposed of it.

    • tbp

      I considered that Shanann may have lost control of her bladder or bowels when he strangled her. If that is the case, he had to clean up in order to prevent the rest of the house or his work truck from being contaminated. I do think he would have wanted to clean up a mess quickly. I noticed him (in a police video) eyeballing the suitcase that was in close proximity to a detective. It appeared as if he was checking it out for some reason. Maybe he wanted to make sure it wasn’t contaminated like Shanann’s clothes.

      I considered the fibers, too. I wondered why he would even care if his fibers were on her clothes. He didn’t ever expect anyone would find her to test for evidence.

  8. coolgirlrocks

    I keep thinking about Shanann’s wedding ring. He must have removed it from her dead finger. Did o he deliberately leave it in the bedroom that night, or did he plant it there the next day when he was in the house hiding cell phone and Apple watch in the cushions.
    I too feel sorry for Deeter. He never does seem to ever get any attention. Does anyone know what happened to him?

    • Marie

      Cool girl, Deeter is with Shan’nan’s brother Frankie now

    • Captain Cassidy

      Betting it was planted. Dude was darting all over the house massaging the crime scene. I think he had in mind to sell it. That first day, he used it to try to convince the police that his wife had left the relationship and the house on her own steam.

      Deeter’s fine. Shann’ann’s brother took him in and he’s adjusting pretty well, sounds like!

  9. LGW

    But I feel if she was feeling run-down and sick from being pregnant, which she was on that trip, maybe she left the suitcase downstairs for CW to bring up later. Her doctor may have even told her she can’t be carrying things like that upstairs because she was so high risk.

    • Marie

      LGW, could she really be that high risk? She had been flying to and from NC,, then to Arizona and back.

  10. Cheryl Filar

    There’s something inconsistent here. On the one hand we say Chris is dumb as per his overall execution of murdering his family, as well as per his post-murder behavior—emotionaless, exhibiting stress while watching the neighbor’s security video and during the porch interviews, i.e., a poor actor. On the other hand, we speculate about his logistically dealing with DNA residuals, placing diversionary phone calls, etc. So which is it? Calculating/crafty/silver fox…or criminally clueless…or both?

    • mitzi2006

      I personally don’t think he’d be over concerned with DNA, her clothes could pick up fibres and DNA just from laying them on a bed, picking up a shirt of his and having it touch her clothing she was wearing. They always say DNA evidence is tough because when you all reside in the same house you pick up each other’s hair, fibres, skin cells easily and it’s expected you’ll find all the DNA mixed together

    • nickvdl

      I think you answered your question, Cheryl. The books aren’t called Two Face for nothing.

      In DRILLING FOR DISCOVERY I’ve been trying to account [in more depth] both for the very fast and effective investigation of this case [not all was due to law enforcement, in fact most wasn’t], as well as Watts’ effective crime scene management at one site, while it was disastrous at the other.

      Watts wasn’t a terrible con artist one-on-one, just as an MLM promoter seen in isolation might be quite convincing. But as soon as you contextualize Watts/MLM you can see he/it doesn’t stand up to even the slightest scrutiny. Watts wasn’t used to being second-guessed to any significant degree, and neither are MLMers in their Kool-Aid flavored echo chambers.

      Pull that setup into a murder investigation, which is about facts and evidence and real consequences to behavior and words and claims, and you can see how the weight of the real world simply cannot be resisted by a house of cards [whether a personality or pyramid scheme]. Suddenly the consensus trance is broken because as much as one can talk up something [“We’re all Thriving, everything is ok”], the reality is someone is dead, and someone is responsible. [“We’re not Thriving, everything is not ok”].

      The Watts case is a microcosm for Watts wrong with the world – we’re a society that tends to lie to itself, and worse, we’re incentivised not only to tell lies, but to believe them. True crime exposes these incentives as inauthentic and ruinous. Those who gain aren’t the puppets, it’s the those who made all the strings. But the puppets are also to blame for allowing themselves to be strung up and manipulated. That happens when people have no sense of individuality or identity, and cannot think for themselves.

      True crime is the antidote – or it can be. Through true crime one learns how to think for oneself, and more critically about others and the world we live in.

      • Cheryl Filar

        Very insightful, Nick. Thank you. I’m looking forward to your upcoming book.

      • Captain Cassidy

        Spot on.

        I remember one of the law guys sounded almost amused when he talked about Chris taking the plea deal. They said he had been quite angry about his story selling so poorly with them. In the tiny pond he usually inhabited, he would have sold the story. But when his pond emptied into the bigger one in the world at large, suddenly his con game was woefully ineffective.

        I date a guy exactly like this, I suddenly realize. Jeez, how’d I miss that? The resemblance is just uncanny! The nitwit ended up doing hard time for grand theft. He stole an enormously expensive computer rig with all the trimmings from a big box electronics store where he briefly worked and hightailed it back to his tiny hometown. We met just a few months later. He told me the story with great pride. I remember thinking OMG does he think this major retailer will be okay with him stealing $8k of stuff from them? Yes, that’s exactly what he thought. Blew my mind. We lost touch. Years later, he showed up again on the game we all played, and he accused me of tipping off the store! He’d just gotten out of prison and he’d stewed for years thinking I’d turned him in for being a terrible boyfriend! Just so provincial in thinking. I hadn’t, and I laughed so hard at him for thinking I had. Like that’s what it would have taken for him to get caught! Chris comes from the same weird mindset. Smart and can manage okay in his accustomed setting, but in bigger ponds, just no idea how to function.

      • Captain Cassidy

        BTW, one of the funniest things I’ve read lately involved an Amway bot trying to sell the scam to a real live accountant! LOL! The accountant quickly shredded the income claims the bot’s upline tried to make. All they could do in response was keep trying to get the accountant to listen to “tools” CDs. It was just a glorious disaster.

        An acquaintance of mine is a pastor. Very affirming and inclusive, the polar opposite of an evangelical culture warrior. She’s got a bazillion degrees and an M.Div. from one of the best seminaries in America. One day she was relaxing at home in jammies and the doorbell rang. It was a pair of young missionaries, Jehovah’s Witnesses. Smiling, she invited them in… Those poor kids didn’t know what hit ’em. Apparently her first salvo involved a casual question about whether or not they knew that their pronunciation of Jehovah was incorrect. I think of Chris slamming up against real LEOs in the same way. Those cops saw him coming and going.

        • kooker


      • Captain Cassidy

        Dated! Not date! Dang autocorrect! It was years ago.

      • mitzi2006

        I wonder if shanann lied to herself for years or if this really was the first time it occurred to her when she texted that she now knows what’s been wrong, Chris had no emotions, only she did. That was the same thing said about Scott Peterson, He never got mad, showed any emotion, never confrontational, always polite. Seems they might be identical twins

  11. Karen

    I know some of you watch Golightly’s channel. I don’t anymore. Shan’ann’s brother Frankie is her buddy now and he’s also just become one of her room moderators. Just a fyi.

    • Cheryl Filar

      Doesn’t surprise me. Thanks for sharing.

  12. Roo Barton

    Regarding the bra thing….as a busty woman myself, I tend to wear one all the time. I rarely go without because I fear gravity will take over. I noticed a video where she said she just got out of the shower, and I noticed she already had her bra on. She probably was the same way. All of her ‘revealing’ tops even had bras underneath. So it is not unusual to wear one to bed. At least for us naturally endowed women anyway.

    • nickvdl

      Good observation, thanks Roo.

  13. nancyjames3358

    I’ve had a lingering question on these Thrive videos SW was addicted to making.
    Who was watching them?
    Potential “promoters”? Her downline? Her upline? Hollywood Agents?
    I get why she was making them.
    I don’t get who was watching them.

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